YTFC Forum

Somertonian · Joined: 08 Jan 2006 Posts: 145

All these things are a bit personal and remind of the bullying some 'less than attractive' kids got in the school playground.

Perhaps with a bit of make-up and a hairdo, the tabloids would be less likely to promote the hysteria that they are creating at her expense. They do this to sell newspapers - nothing else.

If mistakes have been made, they can be corrected for the future. This needs to be done rationally and based on fact - not on people's perceptions of how someone looks (someone, BTW, who is far more successful than most of us).

:)

S

Musey · Joined: 08 Jan 2006 Posts: 121

It's just fun - as a woman (ok...young woman) I fully respect what she has done throughut her very successful career - and she is someone I aspire to be - My ambition is to work in politics in some form once I've finished my education.

I can't help but be critical of these recent activities though.

I have a lot of respect for her.

But none for Thatcher.

darren · Joined: 28 Dec 2005 Posts: 335 Location: Yeovil, Somerset

So how is Thatcher different? She's done all those things Ruth Kelly has done.

You may not agree with her politics, but so far she's been the world's most successful female politician.

Musey · Joined: 08 Jan 2006 Posts: 121

As soon as she abolished tripartism - she lost me.

Glovemeister · Joined: 08 Jan 2006 Posts: 60

Somertonian:

Successful? Her/Him?...you know who I mean...the Minister for Education aka Minister for POP (Protection of Paedophiles).

I find the "hasn't she done better than us"/success arguement fatuous and flawed. I'm afraid she is a nonentity in a government full of intellectual pygmies. Most of these simpletons have not held down real jobs and what exactly has been Ruth Kelly's experience prior to taking this role?

As a father of two young daughters (and yeah, for once I'm being serious now), I want to know that when my children go to school (and remember: they're not just being educated during this time, they're also out of my care and watchful eye) that they are safe and not likely to fall victim to some sick pervert.

It isn't much to ask.

Ruth Kelly and those that she takes ultimate responsibility for, should know better than to knowingly let such sickos get into an a position where they can have contact with children in their everyday employment. The change in the law today (the words, horse, gate and bolted spring to mind) is an admission that Ruth Kelly was negligent in her position and thus should go. In my business if I had been this inept, I would have to go, if not I would be dismissed. End of story.

All this aside...Ruth Kelly certainly ain't no lady.

Musey · Joined: 08 Jan 2006 Posts: 121

Good post.

I think its appalling she let this happen - and I think she should walk.

I don't care about what shes done today - it should never have come to this!

darren · Joined: 28 Dec 2005 Posts: 335 Location: Yeovil, Somerset

This will stir up a hornet's nest.

An acquaintance of mine is on the register. Before an angry mob starts massing baying for her blood, I'll give you her story. She worked as a primary school teacher. A pupil of hers fell over, and she picked her up. The child was crying, so she gave her a hug.

To cut a long story short, the head saw this, and thought it inappropriate behaviour. She lost her job, and thanks to the head and the LEA, can never teach again.

Take a look at the case that brought the whole Ruth Kelly thing to light, the teacher who had an 'inappropriate' relationship with his pupil. The way it's being put about is that he abused her. What the media fails to tell you however is that he subsequently married his 'victim', and since that day, 19 years ago, they have had 3 children together. According to his 'victim', nothing at all happened until well after she was 16.

At the other end of the scale, a primary school teacher from Yeovil, who 'touched' several children in his care is still in prison. He is released shortly and will be on the register. He will probably come back to Yeovil.

Rapists, child killers, etc are also on this list.

The point I'm trying to make here is that there is one list that all of the above are now on. Is that right? Is it right for the first example to be treated the same as the last one? The second case, it depends on how you feel about it, but I don't think he should have been on the register. The last one, I know what the reaction will be.

I do understand the strength of feeling. I have a 9 year old boy and a 5 year old girl and would kill to protect them. But a newer system needs to be devised. One that addresses the concerns of parents, but doesn't pander to the 'witch hunt' mentality in this country that sees a pediatrician's house burnt down.

Glovemeister · Joined: 08 Jan 2006 Posts: 60

Good post Darren.

I totally agree with you, though I also think lessons should have been learnt after Soham and at the moment the law is an ass and Ruth Kelly has reacted to situations rather than been proactive before all this happened.

darren · Joined: 28 Dec 2005 Posts: 335 Location: Yeovil, Somerset

I think Soham probably caused more problems, rather than teach any lessons.

The News of the World whipped the mob into a frenzy, and now we are in this situation.

Ever wondered why there are a lot less males in teaching jobs these days compared to 20-30 years ago? They're too scared to in case someone points a finger.

Glovemeister · Joined: 08 Jan 2006 Posts: 60

Anyway this has all got a bit heavy...

Point is Ruth Kelly is a man. :lol:

Somertonian · Joined: 08 Jan 2006 Posts: 145

paedatrcianpaedophile? I won't be pedantic!

I guess the system whereby SOMEBODY decides each case on its merits would be ideal but, hey, that's what we had. I would hope that a special eye would be kept on anyone given 'the benefit of doubt'. though this may not be practical.

If a decision to let someone teach again, then both parties should be up before the courts. One for the offence and one for aiding an offender. This would ensure the decision is fully scrutinised.

The process that RK followed had been in place for many years and before this government was elected. Has any child been abused by any of the people who have been allowed to teach?

Regardless, my point was that the childish remarks about RK's appearance were reminiscent of school bullies (who are a bigger danger to our kids).

:)

S

Musey · Joined: 08 Jan 2006 Posts: 121

Unfortunately - the majortity of parents would probably love the introduction of one list, even if it does exclude those wrongly convicted of sex offenses....

I like the idea of an expert panel judging whether or not these people are fit to work with children.

I also think that the laws on physical contact with children are ridiculous. Its another media frenzy.

Final note - I really liked Ruths outfit yesterday

Lovely jacket.

=]

Ebony · Joined: 09 Jan 2006 Posts: 13 Location: Chester

Why was it that after Soham, the Government forced out a senior police officer because his force made mistakes. Surely the same principle should apply in this case and Kelly should go.

I am concerned from two angles, firstly as a father. Secondly, I am a school Bursar, who repsonibilities include ensuring that we CRB any one who is about to be employed. Yet I do not actually get to see the results or have an opportunity to make the decison. That is undertaken by someone at County (at least). Yet if there was an incident, the Head and I would probably have most of the flak.

darren · Joined: 28 Dec 2005 Posts: 335 Location: Yeovil, Somerset

Unfortunately, although County take the CRB application, it's processed by a third party. Who then outsource the work to their Indian partner. So many links in the chain, something can very easily go wrong.

One of my many hats is as a school governor, as well as being a Contractor working for County Hall. That's on top of being a parent. Thankfully there's not been an incident at the school I'm responsible for, but I can see what would happen, the school staff (head etc, and govs) would get the flak, as you have pointed out. The people making the mistakes (County and further down the chain) would never have to answer for it.

Yorkshire Glover · Joined: 08 Jan 2006 Posts: 284

darren";p="1527 wrote: › docWrite("quote") An acquaintance of mine is on the register.... She worked as a primary school teacher. A pupil of hers fell over, and she picked her up. The child was crying, so she gave her a hug.
To cut a long story short, the head saw this, and thought it inappropriate behaviour. She lost her job, and thanks to the head and the LEA, can never teach again.

The new proposals as outlined by Kelly would take the decisions from Ministers and give her a right of appeal to the new Panel. It might be a while before this new bureaucracy swings into action, but she can help herself by getting supporting evidence together that could help her build a case for an appeal whilst she is waiting.